Texas school shooting

[gave_agave]

The social networks are for profit companies, working in the interest of their shareholders. They focus on getting as much information from their users as possible. They do that by bringing like-minded people together, people with the same ideas and views. People naturally want to be part of a group, and spend more time reading things they already agree on (seeking confirmation, leading to confirmation bias). The networks cater to that. Superficially, bringing like-minded together sounds like a good idea, but, in my mind, it isn't. I set up some fake account on facebook some time back (set up an email account, set up the facebook account with it, posted a few pictures taken during holiday I hadn't posted elsewhere, not of myself though), and 'like' things I disagree with. I quickly got friend suggestions, befriended them, got and accepted friend requests, sent friend requests which were accepted, and entered a completely different bubble, with a completely different stream of information fed to me compared to my 'real' account. It's eye-opening, it looks like a completely different world. It's not unexpected at all that people who get fed the same type of information all the time, actually start to believe that (that's a tactic which has been used for hunderds of years).
I think it would be better to bring people who have some things in common, and some things not in common together, and stimulate them to find common ground. Like here, we like succulents, and are having a good discussion about guns. Different opinions maybe, but not very different. It would be very hard to have discussions like this in pro-gun or anti-gun groups on a social network. The same things happens in real life. You're put in a class of kids because you're the same age from the same area. And you make great friends (with some), that would never happen on a social network. Or you join a company to work for. You might have some interest in the job, but you make great friends, with people you would otherwise have never met. That's much harder on a social network (in my experience), because it caters to only feed you things you already agree on.

[mickthecactus]

The TX politician whose name I mustn’t mention says the answer is to lock more doors so the gunman can’t get in.

You couldn’t make it up.

Oh, and Trump is praying for victims, families and the entire nation. How lucky are you,

[Meangreen94z]

The story keeps changing but the latest was a teacher came outside to see the commotion and when she ran inside the door didn’t latch. Otherwise it would have been locked and slowed him down. He then shot out a window on the classroom door to unlock it and enter. From what I’m gathering there will a huge lawsuit against the Uvalde PD. They waited almost an hour to go inside and prevented a tactical team from immediately entering upon arrival. The rule for years has been to immediately engage the shooter to prevent further deaths. The campus policeman in Florida who panicked and did nothing during the Stoneman Douglas shooting got in deep trouble for it.

[Meangreen94z]

Ted Cruz isn’t from Texas, he moved here to be a politician. He’s actually from Canada and acts like he has no real interest in the state. Only Texas politician (or musician) to not back out of the NRA convention, and is well known for flying to Cancun with his family while Texas lost power and people froze to death February 2021.

[Stan]

The NRA Won't allow attendees to bring guns. Too dangerous.

[mickthecactus]

Just heard there are 400m guns in private hands.

[Meangreen94z]

The Secret Service only blocked guns in the area Trump was speaking.

[Samhain]

The NRA Won't allow attendees to bring guns. Too dangerous.

Cool headline but their policy suggests otherwise.

During the 151st NRA Annual Meetings & Exhibits, personal firearms may be carried in the George R. Brown Convention Center (GRBCC) in accordance with Texas law. When carrying your firearm, always adhere to all federal, state, and local laws.

https://www.nraam.org/attend/firearms-policy/

[Gee.S]

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[KLC]

I do own guns but I'm not a gun fanatic. I can't in good faith give up my guns, that would leave me unable to protect my family and I from those who wish to do us harm or take what we have worked hard to own. That is the belief shared by most Americans and that will never change.

[mickthecactus]

But is it real or perceived?

Is America so lawless now?

[Samhain]

But is it real or perceived?

Is America so lawless now?

Perceived. There are no threats. Oh wait.

[echo459]

But is it real or perceived?

Is America so lawless now?

Perceived. There are no threats. Oh wait.

Remember all the riots/looting in the last couple years?
Remember all the calls to Defund the Police?
Remember that the cops in TX waited an hour before going into the school and killing the shooter?
Remember that the Police are under NO obligation to protect people.

The US Supreme Court has made it clear that law enforcement agencies are not required to provide protection to the citizens who are forced to pay the police for their "services."

In the cases DeShaney vs. Winnebago and Town of Castle Rock vs. Gonzales, the supreme court has ruled that police agencies are not obligated to provide protection of citizens. In other words, police are well within their rights to pick and choose when to intervene to protect the lives and property of others — even when a threat is apparent.

Remember that when seconds count, the police are minuets away.

[Gee.S]

But is it real or perceived?

Is America so lawless now?

If you read responses, you come to realize it's largely about threats perceived via mass media. No one has broken into my home, or homes of my neighbors or family members. None. I have had vehicles stolen over my lifetime, but not carjacked or any other situation in which guns may have been a factor. I realize there are scary areas/neighborhoods out there (I lived in one or two as a young lad), but for all/most members of a gardening forum, probably fair to say that threats are less than real.

[mickthecactus]

In which case life is identical to mine in the UK. Never had a break in, never known of one. Had a car stolen from a car park many years ago. That’s it.

[Samhain]

But is it real or perceived?

Is America so lawless now?

If you read responses, you come to realize it's largely about threats perceived via mass media. No one has broken into my home, or homes of my neighbors or family members. None. I have had vehicles stolen over my lifetime, but not carjacked or any other situation in which guns may have been a factor. I realize there are scary areas/neighborhoods out there (I lived in one or two as a young lad), but for all/most members of a gardening forum, probably fair to say that threats are less than real.

I live in a rural area, I don’t consider bad but there’s no shortage of crime or drugs(anywhere?). A 77 yo woman made headlines defending herself against an intruder a few years ago. I don’t pay any attention to how much that happens, just recall it, about 5 miles from my place.

[abborean]

We all have beliefs based on our experiences. We had plenty of guns around when I was a kid and it was even promoted at schools though marksmanship programs. It is part of our culture as well as a constitutional right. Millions of guns in our country. This violence is a result of pure evil in our society. The cities with the highest murder rates have the most restrictive gun laws.

[mickthecactus]

Unfortunately school shooting seems to have become part of the culture as well.

As I said at the beginning, our only school shooting was 26 years ago and we have no guns.

[Samhain]

So, with no guns you still have more than zero shootings. 400 million aren’t going away.

[abborean]

Our disagreements regarding private citizen gun ownership are basically between idealists and realists.Idealism is possible because of not having a violent crime committed against you or a family member. Opinions change when reality sets in. I'm not brainwashed by anything in the media and I assure you my IQ is adequate. I envy the idealists and would gladly go back there myself. It is far more comfortable than reality.

[Meangreen94z]

At this point I think rifles need to treated like handguns or alcohol. 21 and up. Clips need to be restricted to 10 rounds. There is nothing sport or defensive of 30 rounds. The difference can give someone time to tackle the shooter. Is it perfect or ideal for either side of the political aisle? No. But it would have at least prevented this shooting.

I think we need to get back to plants, and I think it’s great that they unite people of a broad spectrum of personal beliefs.

[edds]

I cannot understand why anyone who isn't trying to kill lots of other human beings needs an assault rifle.

A handgun if you really think you need to defend yourself - I disagree but I can see the logic.
A rifle or shotgun for hunting.

But assault rifles?

[Samhain]

I have evil black rifles and standard capacity magazines, they operate the same as any semi autos, they are over 70 year old technology. They don’t bother anyone. Somehow I manage to use them for recreation. I own lots of things I don’t need, everything actually. A magazine swap can be done in under two seconds, good luck with your tackling.

[Meangreen94z]

I have evil black rifles and standard capacity magazines, they operate the same as any semi autos, they are over 70 year old technology. They don’t bother anyone. Somehow I manage to use them for recreation. I own lots of things I don’t need, everything actually. A magazine swap can be done in under two seconds, good luck with your tackling.

I would love to see an 18 year old kid, that has owned guns for all of 4 days and just shot several people, reach into a bag and reload in under 2 seconds. None of what is suggested applies to or is intended for a responsible gun owner like you. I think laws need to be in place that restrict access to immature, chemically imbalanced males, and mentally unstable individuals.

[Gee.S]

OK, fun discussion about a not-so-fun topic. I hope our European friends in particular found it enlightening.

I do not believe there is anything new to add, so I will close the thread. Feel free to PM me if you disagree with this decision.

Kudos to all who kept this contentious topic respectful and informative.